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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:13 am 
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Trelliz wrote:
Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
Perhaps games should stop worrying about being "art" or "mature", and just be games. Who are we trying to impress, and why? Isn't it enough that hundreds of millions of people across the world enjoy gaming?


I suppose the problem is that quite often - and mostly by the grossly uninformed - games are still seen as something for children, not as valid mediums in their own right, so when something dealing with mature themes comes along the "won't somebody please think of the children!" brigade denounce the publisher/dev as trying to peddle their filth to sweet, innocent children, when it clearly isn't designed for them at all.

I think as subsequent generations grow up with/raise their own kids with games, there will be a greater level of understanding of the validity of games as a medium to explore such themes without the daily mail calling for the banning of this sick filth.


And that's why no-one worth listening to ever reads the Daily Mail.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:24 am 
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Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
And that's why no-one worth listening to ever reads the Daily Mail.


However, a lot of people DO read it, and assume that it is correct. As such, gaming is a medium that needs "defending".

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:32 am 
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Trelliz wrote:
I think as subsequent generations grow up with/raise their own kids with games, there will be a greater level of understanding of the validity of games as a medium to explore such themes without the daily mail calling for the banning of this sick filth.

So it's just running in to the same problem any new form of media has ever experienced, which will simply disappear over time, as those who are too old and set in their ways to understand it start to die off. When TV was new, it was evil. When Rock and Roll music was new, it too was evil. strawberry float, when they started printing books, that was looked down on, too. There are people out there who just don't like new and different, because they don't want to take the time to understand it, and it's better to just rise above it and ignore them, than to feel like you have to engage in some pitched battle with them to defend your side of it.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:32 am 
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Trelliz wrote:
Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
And that's why no-one worth listening to ever reads the Daily Mail.


However, a lot of people DO read it, and assume that it is correct. As such, gaming is a medium that needs "defending".


Not against idiots.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:34 am 
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Idiots are the most destructive kind of critics. They don't understand logical reasoning and even if you were to somehow win the argument, there are a bajillionty more just like them.


Last edited by TheTurnipKing on Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:35 am 
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Why are you being so abrasive MCN?

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:40 am 
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Dual wrote:
Why are you being so abrasive MCN?


Because I dislike the "victim" stance that gamers as a whole seem to take. Just enjoy your hobby, and ignore anyone whose IQ doesn't reach double figures.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:40 am 
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Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
Not against idiots.


On the contrary, it is against idiots that it needs defending - you can reason with intelligent people, explain your arguments and reasoning, and they will understand. Idiots will ignore everything you say, respond with sweeping generalisations and make lots of noise indicating their displeasure, attracting other idiots who do the same.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:42 am 
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Trelliz wrote:
Idiots will ignore everything you say, respond with sweeping generalisations and make lots of noise indicating their displeasure, attracting other idiots who do the same.

So why waste time arguing with them, if you already know it's falling on deaf ears?

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:42 am 
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Trelliz wrote:
Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
Not against idiots.


On the contrary, it is against idiots that it needs defending - you can reason with intelligent people, explain your arguments and reasoning, and they will understand. Idiots will ignore everything you say, respond with sweeping generalisations and make lots of noise indicating their displeasure, attracting other idiots who do the same.


But why do you care what idiots think? There may be a lot of them, but they're idiots. They're not going to be changing the opinions of anyone who can spell their own name.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 11:52 am 
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Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
But why do you care what idiots think?


Because the collective voices of enough idiots leads to things like SOPA, censorship of game content at a legislative level, and other such "good ideas".

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:06 pm 
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Trelliz wrote:
Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
But why do you care what idiots think?


Because the collective voices of enough idiots leads to things like SOPA

In fairness, SOPA is purely corporate greed. Nothing to do with idiots, really.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:07 pm 
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TheTurnipKing wrote:
Trelliz wrote:
Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
But why do you care what idiots think?


Because the collective voices of enough idiots leads to things like SOPA

In fairness, SOPA is purely corporate greed. Nothing to do with idiots, really.


Ok, I was being a bit extravagant with that, but I hope the point is still the same.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:09 pm 
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I love that a thread about the value of games as a credible form of entertainment has degraded into a verbal pully-hair-fight.

Shine on, you crazy diamonds.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:12 pm 
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I'm still waiting on MCN's post about why he loved Red Dead Redemption.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:22 pm 
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Why must we defend the medium? It regularly produces works that are stylistically superior, dramatically superior, intellectually superior and better scripted than the crap Holywood serves up while making the whole lot interactive and producing it for less money. The film industry should be embarassed the way it is constantly being outdone by videogames.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:25 pm 
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AKA: Stealth Troll
Meed-yum.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:26 pm 
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Meep wrote:
Why must we defend the medium? It regularly produces works that are stylistically superior, dramatically superior, intellectually superior and better scripted than the crap Holywood serves up while making the whole lot interactive and producing it for less money. The film industry should be embarassed the way it is constantly being outdone by videogames.


Because there are people who flat out refuse to accept any of the stuff you've just highlighted. Doesn't that make you even slightly annoyed?

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:37 pm 
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Tafdolphin wrote:
Meep wrote:
Why must we defend the medium? It regularly produces works that are stylistically superior, dramatically superior, intellectually superior and better scripted than the crap Holywood serves up while making the whole lot interactive and producing it for less money. The film industry should be embarassed the way it is constantly being outdone by videogames.


Because there are people who flat out refuse to accept any of the stuff you've just highlighted. Doesn't that make you even slightly annoyed?

Their loss.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:42 pm 
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Somebody Else's Problem wrote:
Dual wrote:
Why are you being so abrasive MCN?


Because I dislike the "victim" stance that gamers as a whole seem to take. Just enjoy your hobby, and ignore anyone whose IQ doesn't reach double figures.

Don't do that.

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